--- Joel Rees <joel_rees@sannet.ne.jp> wrote:
> On 2004/03/08, at 1:44, Charles The Hawk wrote:
> 
>> I help with an orphanage in Zambia which was
>> given several old Mac IIci's and a Quadra 950.  We
>> would like to use them to teach the orphans basic
>> computing skills.
> How old are these orphans? And what do you mean by
> "basic"?
6-18.  Typing, introductory word processing,
spreadsheet, programming, O/S configuration, etc.
I don't recall seeing many jobs available for MacOS
administrators, but there is some demand for Unix-
like systems administrators.

> netBSD may not be appropriate. Mac OS 7 probably is
> okay, really.
I haven't seen much practical "freeware" software
available in my searches.  That's a major problem.

>>  For security reasons, all the
>> IIci's had the hard drives erased, so we've been
>> installing the O/S on them.
> Pretty straightforward, isn't it? Especially when
> compared to, say, pre-1996 MSWxx. ;-) Hey,
> installing the Mac OS could actually be a good 
> assignment for some of your beginners, don't you
> think?
Heh, i guess that would be my own children.  They
are the ones installing the OS to see which machines
work and which don't.

>>   I'd really prefer to
>> teach them using something not so proprietary,
> Well, I don't particularly consider the old Mac OS
> any more proprietary 
> than the usual option. It's a lot easier to use at
> the beginner's level, too.
I doubt there are any Macs being used commercially
in Zambia.  We are trying to help them get jobs.
Perhaps i'm wrong, but i think someone familiar with
a Unix-like system can more easily pick up other
systems.  If you can drive a tractor/trailer, you
can probably drive a car, but the reverse isn't
necessarily true.  I think my own children who have
grown up with Linux, are far more proficient with
computers than their friends who have only known the
"Start" button.

>> However, when i run the Booter, i
>> get the message "Bye-bye [blah, blah]" and the
>> machine freezes.  Heh, it certainly *shouldn't*
>> be done like that.
> Which Linux are you using, and which utilities? And,
> incidentally, there's supposedly a useable Mac68k
> Debian build. Looking at that may help.
I eventually got the mkfs copied and initialized the
partition, but the booter still locks up.  I'm not
having much success with Debian either.  It doesn't
seem to work very well with 8MB RAM.  My son is
working on a stripped down root.bin to see if we
can get that to work.  However, from searching the
mailing lists, it looks like netBSD might work a
bit better than Linux on slow, small RAM machines.

>> I'm booting the Mac with no extensions, virtual
>> memory disabled, 32 bit memory on, video set to
>> 1-bit.
> How big are your disks? (I suggest > 300MB.) How
> much RAM in the machines? (I suggest > 16MB.) If you
> don't have FPUs, are you using the marvelous soft
> floating point builds that have been getting so much

> attention on the list lately?
Most have 230MB HDs and 8MB RAM.  The ones with 80MB
drives and the IIsi's with only 4MB RAM we were going
to use MacOS on for the introductory stuff. I
was hoping to use the others for more advanced
training.  No way to increase the memory as there
are only 1MB SIMMs.

>> Perhaps i should just give up the idea and try to
>> find a good typing tutor or something what will
>> run under MacOS?
> A GUI text editor and some other sundry tools are
> included in the system install disks. You can
> download Macintosh Programmers Workbench (CLI,
> assembler/compiler) and various debuggers from
> Apple for free. (Mac OS 7.5 can also be downloaded
> for free.) Last I looked, MacPerl was still
> available.
Yeah, i've downloaded 7.5.3.  I'll look into the
programmers stuff.  That may be the route we end up
going.  There were a few PC's we're installing
Debian on, but we have to buy monitors, keyboards and
mice for them, which we're unable to do at this time.
The Macs came with everything.

> You might want to ask the people who
> unloaded the old Macs on you if they'd be willing
> to unload a copy of ClarisWorks (word processing,
> spreadsheet, simple drawing) your direction as well.
I don't think that's a possiblity.  I think the
computers changed hands several times looking for
someone who could put them to use.
 
> With a little determination, you might get MRJ to
> run some simple Java Applets for you. Plenty of
> other stuff still floating around, too.
Don't know what MRJ is, but if anything Java can
run in an 8MB system, i'll be amazed. :)

> I think I'd probably use the Mac OS for the
> beginning and non-technical 
> stuff, reserve netBSD for the kids who want to learn
> the technical side of things.
Yep.  That was the plan.  If only i could get
NetBSD working.  It locks up after the "Bye-bye"
message.  The only reference i've found to this in
the archives suggested it might be going to serial
console, but there was no followup nor hints on what
to do if that were the case.

Thanks,
Charles

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